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Someone to help me learn Japanese?
alongside Rosetta Stone
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ProperBritish
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Someone to help me learn Japanese?
im going to get a book for this, to note down all the things i need to remember, and learn. but someone who knows... answer me this.

should i learn in Romaji, Kanji, Kanji + Furigana or Hiragana + Katakana?

I really want to learn in the non-latin based form, but maybe note down all of the ones i use to remember their pronunciations.

im doing ok in rosetta stone atm using Hiragana/Katakana and native speech.

halp.

also consider this as my log for learning Japanese.

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(This post was last modified: 03/01/2010 06:39 PM by ProperBritish.)
03/01/2010 06:39 PM
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feinicks
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
My opinion:

Conversation level spoken Japanese will be far effective. For that along with Rosetta Stone, you should use audio tutorials (like Primsleur's Japanese). They will really help you A LOT.

Script wise, you will, at one point, have to learn all of them. Perhaps, you can start with Romanji so that you understand the language. Hiragana + Katakana + Kanji are important, mind it.  If you ARE serious (as I am), you can take up Japanese classes. The thing about Japanese (or any other Language) is that you learn a lot more when you are being taught by someone. The key is interaction.

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03/01/2010 08:05 PM
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Kana
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
sadly, learning japanese with love for anime alone is not enough. :P you WILL, trust me, give up after 1-2 months.
experienced. set more goals for yourself, not just i want to be able to understand anime bla bla bla. every single narutard out there want to too. except the dummies watch it on Cartoon Network xD

it has been 3 years since i started learning by myself, the first two years was total slack. i got past all hiragana, katakana, and 40-60 kanji, was able to very slowly read raw manga. with the help of dictionary.
and then i gave up for two months, using i still have a long way to go as an excuse, when i come back, all the kanji is gone from my head and i had trouble reading hiragana.

so i decided to set goal, I'll go to japan, be able to live there for two years, and live a happily ever after story.
extremely regretting not be able to play FFXIII right now. i should be able to, after 3 years.


so yeah, earlier this year i started studying seriously, using "My Japanese Coach" as a teacher, and Kanji Sonomama Rakubiki Jiten as my translator, both on DS.
my japanese coach is good, but with some flaws, eg it demands a high level of self study, as there's no revision lesson, (the minigames is not enough) no homework (they should've set some for you to do in real life). and a steep learning curve.
the dictionary is great though, i must say. :P you can draw your kanji (still have to do the correct strokes order) or Eng~jap words.
after the lesson, i tried to spot as much hiragana, katakana as i can as possible on NND. and try to read em ALL, ALL. no skipping.
then kanji, then the whole sentence :P
now i can pass 2nd kyu(i think) on a japanese test.

uhh now i don't see where I'm going with this, but i gonna continue to bla bla bla anyway.
-no no learning japanese though anime,manga. games is acceptable, not visual novel though, because they are the same as anime manga. if you ask me why:

Quote: Learning Japanese though anime
...is highly discouraged. Seriously. Ask anyone who's ever tried to learn through formal methods, and chances are they'll agree that attempting to learn the language solely from anime, doramas, and the like is futile and stupid. Take a class, use a CD or lessons online. Do something formal other than watching TV.

What foreign TV does do is provide a decent supplement for oral Japanese. Since your interactions are probably going to be clunky at best, television allows you to get a feel for the basic nuances of the language: speed, tones, rhythms, etc. There's also the chance to pick up a few extra words for your vocabulary. Depending on the material, TV shows can also provide some cultural context and basic social rules. The latter is especially important, considering the Japanese language revolves entirely around who you are in relation to who you are talking to.

If you wish to find good programming to try the above, I personally suggest kids shows. By their nature, they'll tend to avoid complex or sophistacted conversations. Even though the style of speech wouldn't be recommended for everyday use, it's easy to follow and a good way to cut your teeth. My personal choices are Chi's Sweet Home and Pythagoras Switch (which has the bonus of being educational, too).

now, i haven't tried it myself but rosetta stone is said to be only work with certain people, there's a level of effectiveness, but not for everyone. so watch out.

one note though, there used to be some japanese in my house in new zealand, as well as school. i talked to them often since some of em are real otaku (man, got to fear his room) and try to understand the convo. it helped me alot :P

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(This post was last modified: 03/01/2010 09:17 PM by Kana.)
03/01/2010 09:14 PM
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Assassinator
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
Heartless141 Wrote:sadly, learning japanese with love for anime alone is not enough. :P you WILL, trust me, give up after 1-2 months.
experienced. set more goals for yourself, not just i want to be able to understand anime bla bla bla. every single narutard out there want to too.

Yeah, that.  You need to be genuinely interested in the Japanese language to even bother trying.  If it's just for understanding anime, forget about it.  Because learning any language is :effort:, and you're not going to make it through.


And yeah, I wish I had that much dedication as you (referring to Hearty).  Started learning C++ a few weeks ago, sort of slacking off again, but this time I do plan on pushing it through.
(This post was last modified: 03/01/2010 10:18 PM by Assassinator.)
03/01/2010 09:57 PM
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feinicks
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
Pretty much yea... Not to mention that almost all Asian languages are very different from Western languages...


Anime is good for fun but not good teachers.

Your call really.

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03/01/2010 10:15 PM
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Kana
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
nop, all language is practically easy. it's like learning a new fighting game with complicated combos. except here, the combos is extremely complicated. same kind of alphabet only give you a certain advantage. it's like moving from street fighter to tekken, mastering the combination forward, down, down forward, punch in SF will get you an easier time playing as some of the character in tekken.

when i was little, english was goddamn hard. but now that i think about it, there's not much apart from past, future, present. and their perfect form, along with the normal daylife combination sentences like "i want, i need, but, and, bla bla bla"

depends on the person really.

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(This post was last modified: 03/01/2010 11:32 PM by Kana.)
03/01/2010 11:31 PM
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Assassinator
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
Heartless141 Wrote:nop, all language is practically easy. it's like learning a new fighting game with complicated combos. except here, the combos is extremely complicated. same kind of alphabet only give you a certain advantage. it's like moving from street fighter to tekken, mastering the combination forward, down, down forward, punch in SF will get you an easier time playing as some of the character in tekken.

when i was little, english was goddamn hard. but now that i think about it, there's not much apart from past, future, present. and their perfect form, along with the normal daylife combination sentences like "i want, i need, but, and, bla bla bla"

depends on the person really.

I didn't say hard, I said :effort:.

Compare learning pure mathematics in uni vs doing 102971057334364134634635736332642623 ^ 99 by hand.  Both are extremely :effort:, but that doesn't mean they are the same difficulty level.  Language is more like the later type - easy, but takes forever to learn.
(This post was last modified: 03/01/2010 11:46 PM by Assassinator.)
03/01/2010 11:39 PM
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ZiNgA BuRgA
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
Living in the actual country is probably one of the fastest ways to learn.  Of course, you do need some sort of "tutor" as well, otherwise you're just going to be lost.  You also should be rather talkative to ensure that you really do learn (not just sit in the corner and disregard anything you don't get).
Oh, and don't slack off and start browsing the internet in English, lol.

Of course, the above isn't terribly practical for your situation.

Lessons would be the next thing in line.  The downside is often the cost however (unless you take it in school and parents/government covers the cost).  If you're doing some degree though, you may be able to get a course to provide credits towards your degree (I know a few friends who are actually doing this) in lieu of some other course.

Books/guides etc are generally free if you take them out from the library, or get them off the internet, but generally require the most motivation to get into.  For languages though, the downside is no talking/listening, though some may come with cassettes/CDs or perhaps audio on internet guides.

You also have to consider what you want to achieve.  Is it only being able to read or understand what people say?
As said, if it's only to understand anime better you will probably lose interest after a while, unless you have special circumstances (eg being apt at learning new languages, Japanese relatives etc).  But there's probably not much harm in trying so perhaps give it a go since you're interested.
At this point, you really shouldn't be considering what script to learn.  In regards to Hiragana and Katakana, you could really just use a table to look up whatever you need.  All you really need past there is memorisation+fluency (both of which you get through practice/experience).  You could probably do something similar for Kanji, though it's a bit more tricky.
(This post was last modified: 04/01/2010 01:59 AM by ZiNgA BuRgA.)
04/01/2010 01:57 AM
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Kana
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
by the way, I'm serious here, play game helps.
for my english
i played though ffx and learned where you suppose to go high and low in a sentence and which type of sentence
i played maple story, and got my quick responding skill (arguing with kids is awesome)
i played though alot of other games, and my vocabulary is vastly larger than other kid at the same age.
i played though phoenix wright, and my reading skill is greatly improved.

do what you like in that language helps. but do it properly.
my brother also play games, but he skips all the dialogues, don't give an eff about the story, and button bash his way though fighting.

i doubt watching anime does anything to you though/

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04/01/2010 02:24 AM
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ProperBritish
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RE: Someone to help me learn Japanese?
my intention is not to understand anime hurr durrr

i have been fascinated with Japan long before i even watched anime (and im talking years, here).

I really really want to live there one day, and before i can even think about doing that i need to learn, understand and appreciate the language.

Now before you all jump the gun and tell me im going to fail, that has just spurred me on to prove you all wrong. Just because i watch anime does not mean it is my sole reasoning behind wanting to learn it. Understand it may eventually just be a side effect, one that i have no problem with, mind you.

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(This post was last modified: 04/01/2010 05:38 AM by ProperBritish.)
04/01/2010 05:37 AM
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